That is according to a new document which Harringey Council would only make available when Reds Away used the Freedom of Information Act to make them.
The document shows that the allocation was set at a meeting of Tottenham’s safety advisory group at White Hart Lane on June 21, 2011.
The match is on March 4, 2012.
Though five people took part in the discussion, the minutes indicate that the decision was made to keep United’s allocation at 1,985 simply by Tottenham’s safety officer Sue Tilling declaring it would stay the same.
Because some members of safety advisory groups (SAGs) have vested interests in what the allocation will be, SAGs in other areas, such as Liverpool and Sunderland, get their licensing or regulatory councils to decide what the allocation for United will be at Liverpool and Sunderland.
This is because the licensing and regulatory committee members are impartial volunteers elected by local residents because of their judgement.
This is also because licensing and regulatory committee meetings are advertised beforehand, open to the public and can hear representations from interested parties, such as fans’ groups.
However, in this instance, neither of those committees have been asked to deal with the issue – despite there being nine months to go before the game.
Bob McIver, Harringey Council’s head of building control, was first to speak on the issue.
The minutes say: “He confirmed there were no issues this season, apart from (with) Manchester United.
“John Alexander, Manchester United’s club secretary, has been in touch with Ms Tilling and Mr McIver to request that United’s allocation be increased for the forthcoming season.
“Ms Tilling hoped that Mr Alexander would be more understanding as he has previously been very supportive of this stance when he was club secretary at Tottenham.
“Ms Tilling stated that, as we were not playing (United) in the Premier League until March, we could monitor the behaviour of United fans until Christmas.
“Ms Tilling confirmed Tottenham were willing to listen to United proposals but no change (to the allocation) will be made at this time.”
However, two weeks on from this issue coming to light, it remains unclear exactly what the safety problems are that concern Spurs.
Two seasons ago, sources said the problem was United fans standing in the South Stand upper tier.
United fans have not been allowed into the upper tier since, so it is not clear if standing in the lower tier or other behaviour is the issue.
The minutes say: “…no change has been made in the fans’ behaviour and, even with (stewards employed by United) present, there was no improvement (in behaviour).
“Ms Tilling confirmed that, whilst United sent five stewards, they were not willing to get involved in dealing with their supporters.”
Next to speak was Sgt Simon Wilmott, a football and events officer with the Metropolitan Police.
The minutes say; “Mr Willmott stated that the behaviour of United fans this season warranted too much attention from police and stewards.
“He requested that the club kept records of all ejections and arrests as this would add weight to the club stance.”
If you would like to give feedback on this decision, here are some useful email addresses.
Reds Away would encourage you to be polite and constructive as any other approach does nothing for the good of the club.
Sue Tilling sue.tilling@tottenhamhotspur.com
Sgt Simon Wilmott: simon.j.willmott@met.pnn.police.uk
Bob McIver Bob.McIver@haringey.gov.uk
We have done well this season with our allocations at villa being increased and Arsenal and Chelsea being decent allocations also but this just shows how hard it is going to be to try and get our full allocation back at places like Spurs and Sunderland.
I do feel some of our fans are to blame at times though and don’t help. For example at the City game other week the gangways round where I was were absolutely rammed. I think if we could get all the away support standing in their seats there wouldn’t be an issue with future allocations but whilst some fans insist on blocking gangways and refusing to move when stewards ask them to we are going to struggle
This is getting beyond a joke, I remember last year at Spurs, they don’t give us the upper tier, but then there is Spurs fans all stood in the top tier where the away fans normally are, so how is that in anyway fair.
United, The FA and the local councils, you test my patients to the limit.
Boycott
Ian,
In fairness, United’s club secretary asked the decision makers to up the allocation.
In effective, the reply was to suggest he was a hypocrite for favouring a drop in United’s allocation when he was still Spurs’ club secretary.
I think a lot of it with spurs is they sell out every game, so are keen to give more tickets to their fans. It’s easy to give the ’safety’ reason and and standing issue, but clubs like Blackburn are happy to give us 7000 as they won’t sell out!
Rob, spot on.
I think the point you mention about Blackburn is valid for Villa this season aswell – they’ve been struggling to sell out hence why they gave us an increased allocation in my opinion.
all clubs stand at old trafford. we should start giving them bad allocations in return, they would change there mind quickly then.
Adam,
United won’t cut away teams’ allocations because they need to sell as many tickets as possible to service the debt.
Most teams that come to Old Trafford dont take up the full allocation anyway so cutting their allocation wont make a difference. Spurs only took the 1,400 allocation back in August, if memory serves me right Sunderland only took the 1,400 (ish) back in November.
if behaviour problems includes swearing in songs then every team is guilty…the stewards at spurs over police the game…i have seen people thrown out for sticking the Vs up….